View Full Version : User Groups, can we set one up???
Bowmancam
01-09-05, 01:46 PM
I see we have the ability to have "user groups" . As i understand, these are a seperate area of the forums only accessed by members with a password and cannot be accessed by the general public.
Can we set one up? Adults only and for regular members (say over 100 posts before admin pm's you with the password) A place were my jokes wont have to be removed aswell as posts like the one PeterM put up yesterday with the caribou. A place were we can be ourselves away from the public eye. Im sure the regular boards would still get used but somewhere were only regular members can view without fear from the everwatching "antis" ...
Please consider. I think it would serve a purpose and keep the publicly viewed topics clean, whilst we can say what we like behind closed doors.
Thanx for your time.
Cheers Cam
A valid suggestion...has been discussed by Admin at length in the past (recently) and at this time we do not wish to create this sort of area.
True, some exist for people who are attending bowcomp for example so we can talk about the details, organisation etc, without cluttering up the public arena. There also exists one for Admin and Mods for a similar purpose BUT these forums exist merely to streamline the process of topic discussion NOT to "Hide" it from public view because it is not publicly acceptable.
I personally do not wish nor think that further discussion of this topic is necessary nor warranted (IMO)...Admin and Mods, as said earlier, have discussed this on numerous occasions and have not viewed it as a postive move for TBGA.
Keep it for the campfire if it can't be said to the general public...
Luke :D
Bowmancam
01-09-05, 02:49 PM
I dis-agree .... but as further discussion is not "warranted" i will save it for the campfire :roll:
Cheers, Cam
Howling Dog
01-09-05, 03:18 PM
I think it is a good idea :idea:
I think itÃ*s an excellent idea, the level of censorship here is getting I bit out of hand I reckon.
There has to be some freedom of speech, well I guess you donÃ*t its your site but there are things that people should be able to comment on, voice there opinion, weather it be good and bad, seams like this site cannot handle the bad stuff in the world.
See ya Pete.
There has to be some freedom of speech,
It's called email, pm's, a phonecall or face to face conversation.
Not everything has to be discussed on a public (albeit restricted) forum.
If there is something that is not suitable, do with it what you would with anything not suitable for this site (foul jokes, language, pornography etc) and keep it to yourself. If you must share it with your mates, use the methods I mentioned above.
This has nothing to do with curtailing the right to free speech...
Luke
jindydiver
01-09-05, 05:41 PM
There has to be some freedom of speech,
It's called email, pm's, a phonecall or face to face conversation.
Not everything has to be discussed on a public (albeit restricted) forum.
If there is something that is not suitable, do with it what you would with anything not suitable for this site (foul jokes, language, pornography etc) and keep it to yourself. If you must share it with your mates, use the methods I mentioned above.
This has nothing to do with curtailing the right to free speech...
Luke
So what we are going to do instead is have more very public discussions showing the world how we are divided over the public portrayal of things that some people find distasteful. A recent example is SteelyÃ*s rusa pic.
If in fact this site is being monitored by the anti-hunting groups (and I believe it is, and you also have said that you do), then the current situation, where people post images or stories that you or another admin find ìnot suitableî and we all spend 3 pages airing our dirty laundry, is doing us more harm than good.
I see three possible courses of action for people wanting to post stories or images on the public forum (and maybe others can see more). We can put up with the status quo (where we have very public arguments about censorship every time someone posts images or stories that someone finds ìunsuitableî for the site), anybody thinking of posting a hunting image or story can submit their material to an admin so that the material can be reviewed and edited if necessary before posting so as to maintain the site to a standard that the admin deem fit or, people can stop submitting stories altogether so that we will have no chance of offending anybody.
Of course we could just have a separate section for stories and pics and anything that might be considered ìunsuitableî. This section would be only accessible by members who have been given the necessary permissions by the admin guys and they can decide who can have that permission. It would not be accessible by password, as the password can never guaranteed to be kept a secret.
Personally, I am sick to death of reading ìwe all know it happens, but do we have to tell the worldî. :roll:
This section would be only accessible by members who have been given the necessary permissions by the admin guys and they can decide who can have that permission.
And just how do we determine who is "allowed permission" and who's not?
Let's face it, apart from an email addy, an IP number, a few pics and posts it is very hard to determine the genuiness (?) of a person. Anyone can come on here, gain 'trust' over a period of time and in doing so work there way into the suggested 'restricted area' of the site and IF there is content in there that may be harmful to bowhunting...we are all screwed and ultimately, Admin is responsible! Maybe some of you are doing exactly what I hypothetically suggested right now..truth is I DONT KNOW...
Something I'm not prepared to shoulder...sorry if you dont like that I'm not willing to take that risk :oops:
why not a vouch system. You know most of the guys who are genuine on here now so from now on have someone vouch for the newbys that will go into that section. I suggested this a while ago and think it is the only way to go. We can post stories and they can be commented on by all before they are opened to the public for viewing. Even admin can miss things that people will take offence to. It can be a stipulation on joining that what is said and arguments are left on the site, like the old addage what happens in the bush, stays in the bush.
jindydiver
01-09-05, 06:35 PM
This section would be only accessible by members who have been given the necessary permissions by the admin guys and they can decide who can have that permission.
And just how do we determine who is "allowed permission" and who's not?
Like I suggested, it would be up to you, but it would be very easy to say that only those people who can get references from other members can gain access. There are many people on here who have hunted with other members here and can vouch for them.
Anyone can come on here, gain 'trust' over a period of time and in doing so work there way into the suggested 'restricted area' of the site and IF there is content in there that may be harmful to bowhunting...we are all screwed and ultimately, Admin is responsible! Maybe some of you are doing exactly what I hypothetically suggested right now..truth is I DONT KNOW...
Something I'm not prepared to shoulder...sorry if you dont like that I'm not willing to take that risk :oops:
But what difference is that to the situation now, where everybody with access to the internet can view ALL content, and one member or another so helpfully points out all our indiscretions with posts complaining about things shown or spoken of?
CanÃ*t you see that you are already accepting the risks you talk of?
I am a member of another Australian hunting site and we have a user group. The only people that even know it exists are the people that are in it, and we were all invited to join it after the moderator had us checked out. It works there, no reason it couldnÃ*t work here.
which other australian site is it mate?
Thinking back Luke i remember you actually offered to do this for stories after my not so favourable donation to the story section!!! :roll: :roll:
Regards...Sparra
you're right mate, but it was after I put it to other admins that it was decided against...I don't see how or why it would be any different this time.
I was trying to find that post and yes luke you told me when i suggested it ,it was a good idea.
jindydiver
01-09-05, 07:14 PM
http://www.australianhunting.net/
i think it was because of lukes earlier question coach
I think itÃ*s an excellent idea, the level of censorship here is getting I bit out of hand I reckon.
There has to be some freedom of speech, well I guess you donÃ*t its your site but there are things that people should be able to comment on, voice there opinion, weather it be good and bad, seams like this site cannot handle the bad stuff in the world.
See ya Pete.
Well Peter forgive give me but you have ruffled my feathers.
Censoship is out of hand?? Why?, because we don't want to see blood & guts, foul language, abuse etc etc
Freedom of speech?? How is it that freedom of speech is hindered by not allowing the above.
Many places in the country/ world you are asked to act responsibly, no different here, say what you like, give your opinion, but there are limitations as with most things in life.
As far as I'm concerned, whether it's on open forum or in "secret" inappropriate is inappropriate. I for one ain't interested in reading about or looking at hunting "stuffups" here or anywhere else
Seems like this site can't handle the bad stuff?? Thought this was an archery information / sharing site with a fair bit of levity.
What advantage is there in promoting or dwelling on the "bad stuff"?, & the "bad stuff" can still be dicussed if it's relevant to the sites intentions.
The suggestion of deciding who and who can't enter the "secret forum", is obnoxious to the highest degree, class distinction comes to mind.
There have been many an accusation in the past re admin & members, accusations of "us & them", if this goes ahead accusations of 'us & them & the others" will be the cry.
I agree with luke on this one and Axe couldn't have put it better.
Adam
I was just reading a copy of modern fishing mag and in it one of the writers was comenting on how the editor has said no more photos with fish with gafs in them or in the esky etc, they want the pictures to paint the rosey thought that they all were caught and released. This is so not to show fishermen in a bad light, seems even the fisherman cannot have the world think that they actually kill and eat fish...
Whatever we post on this forum is going to upset the non-hunters who apperently look at this site no matter how much we edit stories etc, we hunt and we kill. It does come down to common sense what should be written in stories i just think it would be better if all stories were posted behind closed doors. I do not want to read about wounding and see bloody pictures and would expect the same moderation in the closed section as the normal. At least people could post stories and get constructive critism from all on there stories rather than admin having to pull them before most people get to see them.
The suggestion of deciding who and who can't enter the "secret forum", is obnoxious to the highest degree, class distinction comes to mind.
Not class distinction, forum participation would decide.
I have african cichlids and to join a site on them i had to provide my home adress, phone number and have a proper email account not hotmail etc just to see the forums and by some fish cheaper than at a pet shop. Maybe this is another way to go, that the forum is blocked until you join and all is checked out....
jindydiver
01-09-05, 10:39 PM
As far as I'm concerned, whether it's on open forum or in "secret" inappropriate is inappropriate. I for one ain't interested in reading about or looking at hunting "stuffups" here or anywhere else
One persons definition of inappropriate can be entirely different from anotherÃ*s, and I am sure that our members can use common sense and not descend into posting links to porn and such but should someoneÃ*s personal taste define what the rest of us might have the opportunity to view, for example, your disinterest in reading about hunting ìstuffupsî. I know I like to read about them, it being a case of learning from others mistakes.
There have been many an accusation in the past re admin & members, accusations of "us & them", if this goes ahead accusations of 'us & them & the others" will be the cry.
I figure there will of course be an ìus and themî, but I see the fair dinkum bow hunters as the ìusî and the trolls (with perhaps dubious intent) as the ìthemî.
We have over 70 members who have not posted even once (and members can search for new posts), and our pages are available to anybody connected to the internet. If the admin here are fine with the idea of our members endlessly discussing small indiscretions or mistakes on an open forum thatÃ*s great, but Cam was just suggesting a way we might prevent that.
Yeah everything Jindy said!
I'm not going to try write a 3 page speech on morel and ethics on this, I said I think the censorship level is getting to high, I didnÃ*t say that there should be no level of censorship.
I seen it as it Admin that are having all the say, maybe they should ask some of the normal members on what is appropriate and whatÃ*s not, maybe they do, I donÃ*t know.
We all know the level of, what is excessive language, violence, of bad taste that is appropriate for this site, I think its getting higher, higher, so when does it stop, will all posts, stories, picture etc etc have to pass Big Brothers magnifying glass first before there approved to be view in some not to distance future? I hope not, but and the end of the day I will be out doing what I love best, and if things get that tight around here I guess IÃ*ll just go back to talking to my friends the normal way.
See ya Pete.
[quote=Axe]
As far as I'm concerned, whether it's on open forum or in "secret" inappropriate is inappropriate. I for one ain't interested in reading about or looking at hunting "stuffups" here or anywhere else
One persons definition of inappropriate can be entirely different from anotherÃ*s, and I am sure that our members can use common sense and not descend into posting links to porn and such but should someoneÃ*s personal taste define what the rest of us might have the opportunity to view, for example, your disinterest in reading about hunting ìstuffupsî. I know I like to read about them, it being a case of learning from others mistakes.
:shock: Jindy, you may recall that there was an inappropriate & disgusting post (words of members, me included) recently & if that was appropriate in your eyes or the eye of anybody else I'm bewildered, it was members that were crying for admin to remove it because when the poster was asked if he would consider removing it, he flatly refused, his "commonsense" must have been away that day
PeterM,
I suppose the magnifying glass test will need to be there whilst ever people persist in stepping outside of the forum guidelines.
If all adhered to the guideline, there would be no need for admin other than to attend to tech issues. So... the ball is in the members court
BTW, You might like to temper your tongue before using inappropriate remarks like "Big Brother" to describe admin, who are also members with opinions.
As for your last words
"I hope not, but and the end of the day I will be out doing what I love best, and if things get that tight around here I guess IÃ*ll just go back to talking to my friends the normal way."
I hope not also, you alone can make that decision
Axe posted the above Guest, didn't log in :oops:
jindydiver
02-09-05, 11:05 AM
That's right Axe, there was that story (I assume we are talking about the ìtag and releaseì story). But I recall that the opposition to that post was not about the content being too much for our members to handle, but about the light it portrayed bow hunters in were it to be read by one of the many ìmonitorsî that view our site. That example is a perfect case in support of my position. As the objections were all about bow hunters ìimage to the publicî and not actually about the content, that post would have been perfectly at home in a ìsealed sectionî of the forums. Those of us that wanted to read it (and gain an insight into the hunting practices of our members) would be able to access it, and it would be safe from the prying eyes of those that view these pages with a view to finding ammunition to do us harm.
Sorry if you were in fact talking about HoodÃ*s bra post (which maybe should have been posted at www.jokes.com or some such place rather than here)
Gaday fella's..not wanting to get into the debate but if Axe was referring to my story i did remove it within about 30 seconds of recieving a pm from Luke...So i don't think he was talking about that...I think maybe he was talking about a post that had quite a bit of bad language in it....
Regards...Sparra
Bowmancam
02-09-05, 11:46 AM
Looks like I created a monster Ö
The way I see it is we have established a genuine ìcommunityî here with a common thread of bowhunting. Yet, I also believe it goes beyond that. Whilst itÃ*s true the sites members are seemingly only user-names that I will probably never meet face to face, I somehow consider them ìmatesî. If I recount something IÃ*ve read on these forums to a friend I generally say ì A mate was telling me thereÃ*s a few fallow around that areaî, when in fact it was somebody IÃ*ve never met or even spoken with, but I feel connected enough to call them a mate.
Now, Luke has to be commended for the whole concept of this site but also has to realize heÃ*s done more than create a website he has created true friendships across Australia. I appreciate itÃ*s his house and we must play by his rules, but I also know that if I have mates around my house who may be getting alittle rowdy I would ask them to take it to the shed outside were they can carry on without offending anyone inside.
Can we have a back shed so our mates, while still coming to the same house, can head out-back to the shed and talk with their mates? It can be a place where they can discuss anything. If you have steam to blow off, tell your mates. If youÃ*ve got a sick but very funny joke, tell your mates. If youÃ*re having a ëblewÃ* with the missus, sometimes you just have to talk to a mate. This is my point of a ìcommuntintyî, this site is far more than a simple website, it is a genuine Australian community for which all members and admin should be proud.
How about rewarding the members who have helped build this site to this level with a little room to roam. Our own back shed!
Thanx for your time.
Cheers, Cam
jindydiver
02-09-05, 11:55 AM
Sorry Sparra, maybe Axe is referring to the swearing in McSteves post. (Vague references often lead to incorrect assumptions, at least for me they do :oops: )
I think if that is the post referred to, it has little at all to do with the discussion anyway. That post was outside the rules we all agree to when we log on and the admin have every right to just delete away.
Would the rules that apply to the forums we have now not also apply to any forum set up outside the public eye? And would there not also be moderators to police those rules?
I donÃ*t think anybody suggested that there should be a free for all and that the concepts of common decency and respect for others would not apply to a usergroup.
My support for a usergroup is about avoiding all the public hand wringing over our public image and is not about having a place where we can ignore the rules already in place for our forum.
[quote="jindydiver"]Sorry Sparra, maybe Axe is referring to the swearing in McSteves post. (Vague references often lead to incorrect assumptions, at least for me they do :oops: )
quote]
Deliberately left it vague in deference to the poster, so as not to cause any embarrassment and risk this becoming a personal issue, nor does the site need it to be rekindled, But.... let me say it has nothing to do with the above mentioned posts, did those names really need to be mentioned?
Jindy Wrote:
Would the rules that apply to the forums we have now not also apply to any forum set up outside the public eye? And would there not also be moderators to police those rules?
Maybe I have also made "incorrect assumptions", or missed something in reading, as I understand it, those that are admitted to the proposed forum would virtually be given free reign??
If indeed I am wrong & the conditions re membership of this proposal are defined, the conditions/rules be explained, then I may have a different outlook.
May I suggest that the proponent /s via pm-email put forward the proposal to Admin ie Baz, Luke, Adam, along with a clearer view of what is wanted in the way "operating" the proposed forum. That way dialogue will at least begin between admin, mods, & proponents re this request
As with many things, this whole issue is obviously a matter of differing opinions, all of which should be respected, but the answers are often not resolved easily
So that there is no incorrect assumption or confusion on my position, if the proposal is as I read it to be at present, I cannot / will not support it
I put an idea in my post from another forum but no one commented so i will post it again :D You have to be a member to see any forums or post and you have to have a traceable account. So you cannot have hotmail etc. The reason for this happening and it could happen here is that someone posted stuff worth $1000's and people paid and now they have disapeared. It was just a thought for admin, we are all pretty trusting on here but if the worst happened we would have no way to trace them. At least if we had some more in depth account details the police could chase people down. Just a thought for the future.........
for the forum in general. If people went to the bother of joining they would hopefully be hunters and we would not have the debate of worrying about upsetting the anti's ...........it is the old change the channel if you do not like what you are watching. If you do not like hunting do not join you cannot just stumble accross this site and get offeneded by accident and admin would have peoples email details which is traceable.
Just in case something like this happens ?
http://www.radpin.com/BBCPortal/Americas/dyngen1341/mboard52505.htm
Your name really isnÃ*t Bruce is it coach? :shock: :shock: :D
See ya Pete.
What does admin think!!!!!
Heehee...I guess the subject is closed.....
A valid suggestion...has been discussed by Admin at length in the past (recently) and at this time we do not wish to create this sort of area.
True, some exist for people who are attending bowcomp for example so we can talk about the details, organisation etc, without cluttering up the public arena. There also exists one for Admin and Mods for a similar purpose BUT these forums exist merely to streamline the process of topic discussion NOT to "Hide" it from public view because it is not publicly acceptable.
I personally do not wish nor think that further discussion of this topic is necessary nor warranted (IMO)...Admin and Mods, as said earlier, have discussed this on numerous occasions and have not viewed it as a postive move for TBGA.
Keep it for the campfire if it can't be said to the general public...
Luke
Luke I was not talking about a seperate area, if you read my post, but a more stringent application before being able to view all forums.
jindydiver
12-09-05, 02:29 PM
Read it again Jason.
Luke has said it is a great idea for some guys who are going to Bowcomp. But the rest of us can just wait till we meet at a hunt or something.
topendbowman
26-09-05, 08:12 PM
I have to say I agree with Luke and Axe on this one. Even so I do understand the frustrations felt by many members.
"There used to be a time we could be ourselves"..alas that is fast disappearing in this politically correct world of ours.
R.I.P. :cry:
vBulletin® v3.7.0, Copyright ©2000-2008, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.