Voting in elections

[Marcus26]

What is it with people who ONLY ever vote for 1 political party?
That's got to be the dumbest thing I have ever heard of.
How many people filled up at $1 a litre and voted Liberal the same day?
How many small business owners voted for the GST because they ALWAYS vote Liberal?
How many people voted Labour despite them having nothing to offer?
Why do people treat politics like it's a sporting event.
"Yeah I voted for the winner! Sucked in losers!"
"Well I know they suck, but they are the guys I go with!"

So now the question is all you hardcore Liberal voters, once we are paying $1.20 at the pump and interest rates continue to climb, will you vote for them again?
Will the die hard Labour guys in Victoria vote Labour again as all our roads become toll ways?

Why do you vote the way you do?

[humphrey]

im with coach. i just dummy vote because no matter who wins they are going to do something that will upset all of us anyways.

[the devils right hand man]

you should have ran coach you have the answer to every thing :lol:

[Piggy]

I believe you have to try to pick the better of 2 evils

[jindydiver]

Marcus
Aussies traditionally vote with their pockets, and have short memories. And these days there is such a paucity of candidates that have any real alternatives to offer that you are mostly voting for the people you see as the best of a bad lot.

And to you guys who donÌt vote.
If you donÌt join in on the process, how can you then whinge about the outcome?
I am not saying you are, or ever have been whingers, so donÌt start flaming me. But if you donÌt let your vote be counted, then why should anybody care what your view is of the outcome of the elections?

[the devils right hand man]

here here

[Marcus26]

And to you guys who donÌt vote.
If you donÌt join in on the process, how can you then whinge about the outcome?
I am not saying you are, or ever have been whingers, so donÌt start flaming me. But if you donÌt let your vote be counted, then why should anybody care what your view is of the outcome of the elections?
Acally I disagree there. I don't vote. I don't vote because no one is worth voting for. No party is capable of providing me the information that I require to:
A) Trust them to do what they said they would
B) Make a 100% informed decision.

It is my responsability to NOT vote because I can not know what I am voting for.

Anyone who votes one way because "well you have to pick someone" is doing far more harm than I am.

[Mozza]

im with jindy on this one, if you dont have your say (even if it is between useless candidates) you cant complain about the outcome IMO. If not maybe try running as a candidate coach, pretty sweet paycheck :lol:

[jindydiver]

And to you guys who donÌt vote.
If you donÌt join in on the process, how can you then whinge about the outcome?
I am not saying you are, or ever have been whingers, so donÌt start flaming me. But if you donÌt let your vote be counted, then why should anybody care what your view is of the outcome of the elections?

Acally I disagree there. I don't vote. I don't vote because no one is worth voting for. No party is capable of providing me the information that I require to:
A) Trust them to do what they said they would
B) Make a 100% informed decision.



If you are going to only vote when you have 100% confidence that you know what and who you are voting for then you are never going to vote.
And honestly, do you believe yourself so above everyone else that you must demand what you, or in fact nobody else, has the reasonable expectation of.
I think you do, because you preface your comments with an absolute ÏNo party isÓ rather than Ïno party hasÓ.


It is my responsability to NOT vote because I can not know what I am voting for.

Anyone who votes one way because "well you have to pick someone" is doing far more harm than I am.

I didnÌt vote in the Î96 elections, both federal and local for exactly that reason. I was out of the country for the whole election campaign and to vote because of old allegiances is just as bad as a donkey vote.
But to say that you have a responsibility to not vote because, all things being equal, you demand a greater understanding of the policies or motives of the parties than all the other poor bastards that must also live under their rule is a total cop out.

It is everybodyÌs responsibility to vote so that, yes, the best of a bad lot can be chosen.

[Marcus26]

No I believe EVERYONE has the right to the information I require, not just me.
For example I read the propaganda that comes to my house all the time.
From the Liberals it's just an attack on Labour while saying that the country is so good under them.
From Labour it's talk about building schools and a better health care system.
Then they swap when they swap power.

Honestly how can you vote when NOONE is told what you are voting for? Like buying a house unseen and not being able to sell for 4 years.

I have the right to have a say despite not voting, that is my vote.

[Marcus26]

Consider this.

Part of the Liberal's campaign focused on interest rates and how they have kept them low and Labour will raise interest rates causing families to loose thousands etc etc.
Labour said "well it's not under our control"
I believe this is how the Libs won this one, fear.
Now of course rates are set to rise under Liberal. We were obviously misled.
They are not held accountable for their misleading campaign.
That's politics? No that's lying, and if a corporation did the same they would be fined for it.

[jindydiver]

I have the right to have a say despite not voting, that is my vote.

Do you stand behind your convictions and not show up and take your medicine, go to court and try to convince the judge of the rightness of your stand, or do you line up, get your name crossed off and just not fill in a ballot?

[jindydiver]

Consider this.

Part of the Liberal's campaign focused on interest rates and how they have kept them low and Labour will raise interest rates causing families to loose thousands etc etc.
Labour said "well it's not under our control"
I believe this is how the Libs won this one, fear.
Now of course rates are set to rise under Liberal. We were obviously misled.
They are not held accountable for their misleading campaign.
That's politics? No that's lying, and if a corporation did the same they would be fined for it.

Yes Marcus, then isn't it your responsability to help others keep them out of office, to prevent them from using fear and the pocket in order to hold onto power?

[Marcus26]

I have the right to have a say despite not voting, that is my vote.

Do you stand behind your convictions and not show up and take your medicine, go to court and try to convince the judge of the rightness of your stand, or do you line up, get your name crossed off and just not fill in a ballot?
No I have paid a fine in the past for not voting, however I tend to stand in line and get my name crossed off. Why? Because I refuse to put more money into an already bloated and over financed legal system.
If I HAD to vote or pay a fine I would take the fine.

Besides, that is totally irrelevent. Why MUST you choose between obviously bad choices in order to have a say in the process? Surely being a citizen gives me the right to say how the process is conducted. If you want a democratic society then you must accept the fact that some may not like how it is operated.

[Marcus26]

Consider this.

Part of the Liberal's campaign focused on interest rates and how they have kept them low and Labour will raise interest rates causing families to loose thousands etc etc.
Labour said "well it's not under our control"
I believe this is how the Libs won this one, fear.
Now of course rates are set to rise under Liberal. We were obviously misled.
They are not held accountable for their misleading campaign.
That's politics? No that's lying, and if a corporation did the same they would be fined for it.

Yes Marcus, then isn't it your responsability to help others keep them out of office, to prevent them from using fear and the pocket in order to hold onto power?Aha, and who do you replace them with? The other liars? I did vote democrat for a while, untill they:
A) went against their voters wishes and approved the GST
B) Spent their time bickering and backstabbing each other.

Great choices. :roll:

Greens? No thanks, hate hippies.

[jindydiver]

Besides, that is totally irrelevent. Why MUST you choose between obviously bad choices in order to have a say in the process? Surely being a citizen gives me the right to say how the process is conducted. If you want a democratic society then you must accept the fact that some may not like how it is operated.

But you have no say at all Marcus, because you opt out by just paying the fine, or worse, getting your name crossed off but not participating. To claim to be having a say you must stand by your choices and not just send money, but stand up and argue your case. Your excuse about not contributing to a bloated legal system is rubbish, you always have the option of going in and representing yourself.

[ricochet]

Isn't it amazing,we can in this country have our say regarding our politicians,whether we like them or not,and have no fear off reprisals,not like some other countries in this world,that is the greatness of where we live,If you don't want to vote then thats your perogative,but then don't then tell everyone they have voted for the wrong people,

**Labour voters about 45%
**Liberals/National about 45%
**Democrats/Greens 4%

so that leaves about 6% swinging voters that the parties pander to,they know they will get roughly 45% anyway,so lets try for the 6% undecided voters,that will get thme over the line,both parties LIE for their own agenda,and that is POWER nothing else.

Rick

[jindydiver]

It is 100% certain that we will have a government, made up of politicians, no government isnÎt an option. Not voting is the same as taking your ball and going home. Surely it is everybodyÌs responsibility to work within the system we have and to use it as best they can to help the country get a government that it deserves.

All too often these days people talk of their rights but forget they also have responsibilities, and in our political system it is our responsibility to find out what you can about the players in our system (not just complain because they canÌt send you informative enough junk mail) and use your vote to help Australia find the best Government that it can.

If you feel it is a hopeless task and your vote is wasted, then you need to stand up and be counted in other ways. That means if you choose not to vote then you should stand up and say you refuse and voice your opinions (and the reasons for them) in the appropriate forum i.e.; the courts.

[Sparra]

Well personally i don't talk politics or religion and i think this thread should be deleted....

[humphrey]

You beat me to it Sparra. I was going to say the same thing. Even though this is the soap box area, i still think we should forget about politics on this site. A topic like this is just going to be full of people trying to justify that their opinion is the right one, and arguing with anyone else that disagrees. We are all never going to agree on anything, so why dont we just get over it? :roll:

[feral66]

I think that voting should be voluntary and then you will see the bastards working there arse's off trying to get you vote for them. And instead of 6% swinging voters it will be 30% and very few safe seats.

[the devils right hand man]

this is worse than the longbow thread :lol:

[Sparra]

:shock: :shock:

[jindydiver]

I thought it was quite funny when you posted it Marcus :lol: You opened up a hornets nest there . That was your aim wasn't it? :wink: Well done :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Dont be a pussy Sparra ,,nothing like a good **** fight
:wink:

Coach
I don't think that either Marcus nor I think of this as a "**** fight".
Discussion of these issues is what Marcus was looking for and I thank him for arguing his point of view rationally.
We are all entitled to our own point of view, and we are entitled to air our opinion as long as we do it with respect and consideration for others.

It is a testament to the nature of this site that we can do this here, unlike many other forums where sane and rational discussion quickly turns to abuse and ridicule of others.

And to others that donÌt want to read this sort of thread on this forum, they can always exercise the option of not clicking the link to the thread.
:roll:

[Marcus26]

Jimdydiver
I agree, this is a discussion, pity some can not see it as such.
I think people should be able to justify their voting decision. If more people thought about it I suspect they would vote differently.

I'm happy to discuss religion as well. ;)

The legal system is NOT the place to discuss one's ideals and 'make a difference'. (I hate that phrase, it's capitalist propaganda) The legal system is nothing more than a method to enforce laws of society. I have no problem with being forced to register your intent to vote. WHat I am saying is that if you do not approve of any of the options it is irresponsable to vote for one or do a donkey vote.
If only 50% of those registered actually put a vote in it would change the way politicians acted. However if those few million all went to court, well what a waste of time when real criminals could be pushed through the meat grinder.

The politicians do not pander to the 6% swinging voters unless you are in a marginal seat. I am in a safe Labour seat, my vote doesn't mean squat. Only in the senate race do I 'have a say' and even that is a limited option.

Actually the only true way one person can make a difference is to try and run themselves for a seat and even then in a 2 party preferred system you still lose unless you play the game.

I honestly think that if anyone thinks making a choice between Liberal and Labour is having a say in how our country is run then they are in denial.

[jason]

I vote and if only everyone who did not we would not now have 1 party controlling the senate. This is not good for any of us. i am not saying cause it is liberal i think no one party should control our country to such an extent. Iam guilty of wasting the vote as i voted for the fishing party as i did not see the remifications of the liberal party holding the senate coming and i am a unionist. ( not saying labor is much better). I now have my award struck from unlimited allowed items to 20 once they have control. Vote if you are allowed to. It seems most people are unhappy so how did howard win!!!! Your 1 vote you think might not count but if everybody who did not vote and it is as high as you said marcus things might be different at the moment maybe the fishing party would hold the senate at the moment....

[Warlocke]

Most people do not understand the workings of global consumerism enough to make an informed decision at a political level.

I am not saying that I do, but I think I have a better idea than most.

We Australians are susceptible to global market fluctuations to such an extent that we cannot fully control our economy,

When our economy is on par with New York, London, Los Angeles or Tokyo cities, we do not get a lot of consideration when global companies, or other foreigh nationals that have vested interests in our manufacturing or primary production, decide to manipulate pricing or availability.

When interest rates rise, it is to attract investors to leave their money in Australia so we can use it.

If interest rates are too low, then the large investors will look elsewhere to invest their money for a greater return, leaving us with less useable capital for large projects within the country.

Or if other countries have lower interest rates than we, then ours looks more attractive.

So the Labor party were right, and gave us an honest answer.

The Liberals have lied to us, telling us that they can control interest rates.

This has been proven, but how many people would have been able to see the truth or lies in these statements?

Obviously, not many.

To answer the original question, I am a swinging voter who looks at as much information as possible, tries to look at the blatant lies from an international standpoint, assesses what the policies will return Australia over the long term and then vote for whomever I think has enough vision to improve our country for the future.

Nearly didn't vote in a couple of elections, but I still like to think there is always a lesser of two (sometimes three) evils .

[Glenn]

I always vote because I believe my vote is important. What politicians have lost sight is that they are there for is to represent the people of Australia regardless of how they vote. The money they spend is our money and not theirs. The goverment does not make money they collect taxes form the workers and bussiness, I get annoyed when I see how unemployement has been turned into a bussiness these days and the billons of dollars of aid that gets given to countrys that don't use it properly and usless wars.
I feel that the right to vote is a good one and we should exercise the right to vote, but I also believe that if you can't consiensly vote for anybody then it is your right to put a line through the ballot form, that's your right, they can make you turn out to vote by law but they can't make you fill the ballot form in.
To me a true donkey vote is somebody who will always vote for one party regardless of what they do to the country just because that's what they have always done and their farther and grandfather always voted that way.
Being self-employed all of my life I will never forget the hardship brought on by the Banana Republic statement and the Recession we had to have back in the eighties and all of the people who lost everything because we needed this recession. And now we have another bastard from the other side of the political fence waiting in the wings wanting to take over the leadership of this country because he feels it's also his right. I can't see much of anything that is good in our present political state, especially with goverments over the last 20 years wanting to push us down the USA track, just have a look at their country, it's rooted, this use to be the Lucky Country but if keep going down the American track it will be Poor Fella My Country...Glenn...