View Full Version : NSW R Licence
Got my R licence in the mail today and was having a look at available places to hunt and it seems there are plenty of places to go. (thought it would be heavily booked).
Wondering if anyone has hunted under the R license yet, if so what was your experience?
Wellsy
Are you thinking of trying to hunt the forest's they have opened up to firearm's shooter's and dogger's too? These areas seem pretty pointless to me....
I think there is a fundamental problem with the whole idea, as we as bowhunters want to protect the game we hunt, and the game council is fundamentally about wiping out ferals full stop. Do you think that an area highly populated by ferals is going to be made 'BOW'S ONLY'?? No way!....... maybe if bow's were semi automatic :wink:
Rory,
I will be hunting the forests opened up to all hunters.
we as bowhunters want to protect the game we hunt
Why would you want to protect Wild Dogs, feral cats, Foxes Rabbits and the likes?
I think its time to stop thinking our (bowhunters) ethics are any better or worse then any other form of hunting and get behind the Game Council as any extra access to hunting grounds can only benifit our pastime.
I have hunted on properties far smaller then some of these forests which are heavily shot to eradicate ferals and if you spend a little time you can usually still get good results if you know what your doing.
Wellsy
OK, I agree with dogs, cats, rabbits...., but even you didn't mention pigs, goats and deer, there is a difference.
Mate, if I owned a property, I'd release all the bloody feral's I could into the bugger, wait a few years and then hunt em :twisted:
:D
Mate your neighbours would linch you with lots of support :roll:
Oh well.... :lol: You would be invited to come for a hunt :D
aussiehunter
02-06-06, 10:20 PM
rory mate thats not the attitude we like to protray,
in the end they are feral,and that is one of the greatest reasons why we get to hunt so to see that we are helping the removal.
making statements like that is not going to look good for our community
jmho
pat
jindydiver
03-06-06, 06:15 AM
and the game council is fundamentally about wiping out ferals full stop.
Not quite.
The GC is all about allowing hunters access to state forests to pursue their chosen pastime, just like any other Australian is allowed to do. Hunting is our chosen pastime and the fact that we are only allowed to hunt ferals is incidental.
In fact it is illegal to shoot some ferals in some State Forests.
OK, I agree with dogs, cats, rabbits...., but even you didn't mention pigs, goats and deer, there is a difference.
Mate, if I owned a property, I'd release all the bloody feral's I could into the bugger, wait a few years and then hunt em :twisted:
:D
I hope your joking, or have deep pockets. The release of some ferals in Australia is an offence and the fines are substantial.
Jindy wroteNot quite.
The GC is all about allowing hunters access to state forests to pursue their chosen pastime, just like any other Australian is allowed to do.
No its not ,
its about the government finding another way to bleed money out of the people so it can suck up to george bush and give aid to indonesia of course :)
jindydiver
03-06-06, 07:18 AM
Jindy wroteNot quite.
The GC is all about allowing hunters access to state forests to pursue their chosen pastime, just like any other Australian is allowed to do.
No its not ,
its about the government finding another way to bleed money out of the people so it can suck up to george bush and give aid to indonesia of course :)
I assume you are joking :roll:
So far the money it has "bled" out of aussie hunters isn't enough to even run itself and the GC has had top ups from consolidated revenue.
how do you know this mick are you on the committee ?
I dont trust government organisations . And they prove me right time and time again.
jindydiver
03-06-06, 07:29 AM
how do you know this mick are you on the committee ?
I dont trust government organisations . And they prove me right time and time again.
They are a government instrumentality and their finances are on the public record. Do a google search and you will find the reports on the extra money given to them by the state gov’ last year. A google search will also find for you all sorts of info about their general finances (running costs, income from licences, etc‘).
It might not be enough to run itself at the moment mate but it will be and you can bet your left nut on it that when it is they will be cashing in .
As soon as they see that there is good funding available the prices will probably go up too.
this is the land of daylight robbery mate just look at our banks,interest rates,petrol prices.....need i continue
Trophy Bowhunts
03-06-06, 07:29 AM
Lets put it this way I expect that we all agree that it is for the good of hunting wether or wether not they do it for all the right reasons. Being a Queenslander we don't have a licencing system :D :D but then we can't hunt any State, National or forestry areas. :cry: :cry:
Given this I think you southern guys are a bit ahead of us at the present when it comes to getting people out hunting and making it easier to have a place to hunt.
So I say think yourselves lucky that you have got a trade off for the Licience and it is a good trade off.
JMO
Good hunting all
Mick
jindydiver
03-06-06, 07:38 AM
It might not be enough to run itself at the moment mate but it will be and you can bet your left nut on it that when it is they will be cashing in .
As soon as they see that there is good funding available the prices will probably go up too.
this is the land of daylight robbery mate just look at our banks,interest rates,petrol prices.....need i continue
You have gone from “they rip us off” to “I bet they will rip us off” in as many posts. Keep posting and it might get to “yeehaa, they gave me money”.
If you want to discuss the GC and their impact on hunting in NSW you would benefit from finding out some facts first, until then your posts are really just noise aren’t they.
You are right Mick. Regardless of the teething troubles (and there have been plenty) the GC is a good thing overall for hunters in NSW (even if I do object to subsidising the “R“ licence with my “G“ licence).
sorry to disappoint you but i stand by what i said.Ill have a look at the figures but it wont make a bit of difference .how do you know its the truth anyway and whether its a good thing or a bad thing is not what i was talking about!!!!! ill probably join up with it anyway.what im saying is that i reckon they will cash in like all other government organisations do and when they do dont be surprised.
you heard it here already :D .
and calling my posts noise etc lowers it to a new level doesn't it then huh?
just cause someone disagrees with you????
your on your own there mate im just voicing my opinion thats all :roll:
I'm with you on this Jindy...When this was first introduced I was really against it but now that it is in why not just accept it and get behind the idea.
By xmas this year I believe they hope to have openned up almost all state forests in NSW to hunting which can only be a good thing especially for those that have trouble finding places to hunt.
For those that are still against it there is no reason for you to support it,don't get a licence,don't hunt forests and don't hunt deer...you do have choices...Oh and also don't whine when you get busted and fined for doing the wrong thing...
Sparra
oh yeah the hunting side of it is definitely a good thing .like i said ill probably join up with it.
Why cant they open up the forests without fees being involved eh?
that is all im getting at fellas
Trophy Bowhunts
03-06-06, 08:49 AM
As we know lads it all comes down to who can make what out of something that everybody wants. Supply and demand..
The Government has something we want so they work out a way to make money in the long term and make themselves look good....(Geez sounds like a a good business practice, thats strange from a Government). The unfortunate thing is that they start slowly and then bring up prices to make more money...(Just look at all the Licences we have to have to hunt) Shooters Licience $30-00 for Life then $60 for 5 years etc etc. We all know it will gets dearer and dearer. At least we have a decent trade off this time as long as they don't start restricting areas again (Who knows). If the right thing is done I am sure it will be fine but it only takes one moron to do something wrong and you can bet it will all change.
So lets make hay while the sun shines cause I am sure something/somebody will change it sometime.
JMT
Mick
jindydiver
03-06-06, 09:03 AM
and calling my posts noise etc lowers it to a new level doesn't it then huh?
just cause someone disagrees with you????
your on your own there mate im just voicing my opinion thats all :roll:
It has nothing to do with your position on the GC, it has everything to do with you saying you know what is going on (and arguing a position) when it is clear you don’t understand anything about it.
Your opinion isn’t worth anything to the discussion when it is based on what you imagine rather than the facts (George Bush and Indonesia :roll: ). And your refusal to even look at the info available shows you are much more interested in generating heat than you are in shedding any light on the subject.
sorry to disappoint you but i stand by what i said.Ill have a look at the figures but it wont make a bit of difference
Mick
The GC was an idea put up by John Tingle of the Shooters Party. The original act as it was put to parliament was a great piece of work and unfortunately when it was tabled in Parliament the independents and greens got to work and forced 102 amendments to the original reading and we got a bit of a mess that has cost way more than it should have to implement.
Most of the problems have been worked through and we are off and racing, but unlike Victoria where you just send in your money and get a licence, NSW hunters have to go through a fair bit of bull to get their’s.
Warlocke
03-06-06, 09:27 AM
I wasn't in favor of the licencing system when first introduced in N.S.W. but now, after having a good look and seeing the possibilities, I think that it will eventually be a very workable system for Bow hunters.
Was talking to one of the local Rangers a couple of weeks ago and his opinion was that eventually areas of National Park will be opened up, not to shooters, but to Bowhunters and there will be more Bowhunting only areas proclaimed in areas that are sensitive to ultra-sonic balistic projectiles.
I can also forsee that we will follow the American system of letting Bowhunters only hunt in the early open season before rifle shooters.
This system would be worth paying for, and we would be paying a fraction of the costs of the Americans.
Even though I hunt in Victoria, I live in N.S.W. so I will definately get my licence to help in expediting the possibility of this system occuring.
JMHO.
I do beleive the GC will work if they can keep a good eye on and control who is in that area hunting. At the moment Riamukka State Forest and Nundle State Forests (2 of the designated areas under the GC) are out of control, then again they always have been. I was talking to one of the cocky's that border Riamukka State Forest just the other day and he said that the amount of traffic (mainly doggers) has increased 5 fold since the introduction of the GC. Now I know for a fact that not that many hunters are aloud in the one area at the one time! This is where the GC must really get their act together if this is to work. At the moment any hunter who does get their R- license to hunt in either of these State Forests are going to be dissapointed. If the GC can control the hunters in all these designated area's its a big thumbs up from me. I used to work and hunt in both these State Forest's and know first hand what it used to be like and what it is today. Now, I dont go there, maybe in the future it will improve. Just my 2 bobs worth! Scott
aussiehunter
03-06-06, 11:55 AM
it is opening up areas to hunting and hopefully it will do the same in qld in years to come..i look at it as a postive thing,and personally dont mind paying a nominal amount to cover costs of licenses etc.it just the way things have to be done these days,controls and checks etc...
as for this paronia talk ,get real, bush and indonesia
one thing for sure,is when jindy says something,he has reserched the facts and has passed on a lot of good information to this site.
jmho
pat :)
sure is easy to get a bite out him though
Wondering if anyone has hunted under the R license yet, if so what was your experience? :roll:
ricochet
03-06-06, 12:10 PM
Wondering if anyone has hunted under the R license yet, if so what was your experience? :roll:
Yeah Wellsy you sure did get a answer to you ORIGINAL question mate :lol: :lol: ,would be good to hear about what you have asked tho
Rick
Sorry if I was the bugger who stuffed youroriginal post Wellsy :oops: Sorry mate.
Ok, releasing ferals IS illegal etc etc, but FERAL animals are the best animals, deer included, so who wouldn't want a property covered in ferals?? Honestly???
Ok, Wellsy, NO as yet I havn't hunted in the state forests under the R licence, but my local forest is a 90% lost cause in terms of it's hunting. I know 2 local bowhunter's now who have been out there reguarly and have been throughout just about all of it finding no sign at all...
saberhunter
04-06-06, 06:58 PM
yeah mate i got my R licence a while back and i've only been hunting once at nundle state forrest,,,,,,,,we didn't get anything but there was plenty of fresh sign of pigs n deer :!:
Cheers, Saberhunter :wink:
Thanks for the reply, do you think you'll go back to Nundle?
A few points about the GC system of opening up NSW forests for conservation hunting by licenced hunters.
The funds raised, all money raised through selling licences will stay within the GC and does not end up in the general coffers. It is nothing to do with a tax on hunting rather the system has to become self sufficient.
If people want more bows only area apart from the current 7 (this figure should go up with the new areas opening up) get an R licence endorsed for bows. The more Bows licences out there the more leverage there will be to open bow only areas. If there is only half a dozen people with bows on their licence or the bow areas are not being hunted it would appear the bowhunters are not interested in areas set aside for bows only. Numbers count. Bowhunters strongly supporting the system will show the government that opening bow only areas is justified and supported.
I have not hunted on the declared lands yet, but those who have, have told me the booking system is very easy and they have seen and taken game including deer. These were taken in the general forests not the bows only.
This Friday (9/6/06) another 77 forest are slated for opening. This means as of Friday the total forests open to licenced hunters in NSW will be 109. The details of what hunting will be allowed in the new area has not been released yet. All these forests are in the central to northern part of the state. On the 7th of July another 46 forest all in the southern part of NSW will be opened to licenced hunters.
There are a few “hoops to jump through” to get a licence but the idea is this is to raise the standard of the hunters and show hunters are responsible. It was never meant to be an open system where anyone can hunt. If you want to hunt you have to pass some criteria, show you have a certain level of knowledge about hunting and the laws pertaining to it and become accountable. If when hunting in these forests you observe illegal hunting dob them in. They are crooks that are wrecking it for the legal hunters and feeding the antis and greens arguments against the system. Two things will cause this system to fail. Honest hunters not supporting it and illegal hunters breaking the law.
At the end of the day this time last year we had no legal hunting in forests in NSW, in a few weeks time for the cost of an R licence and some time spent meeting the criteria you will by mid july have access to about 1.4 million hectares of public land.
Jindy your comment about subsidising the G licence with your R licence. Sorry I do not understand that comment. Could you please explain what you mean?
Daryl
aussiehunter
05-06-06, 11:21 AM
daryl thanks for all the info and work involved...
pat :)
Agree, really good info Daryl! I guess my opinion about Riamukka and Nundle may have been a bit harsh but thats just the way I see it and I do live very close by. I would dearly love to get back out to some of my old haunts and have a look around but until the GC or the State Forest can regulate the proposed area I am a bit hesitant. Just to many doggers!!! I beleive there would be some very unhappy hunters about if they paid there $60.00 to hunt on State Forests and then every where they went there was someone there before them, eventually those hunters would not bother paying for a license. I know the GC is in its early stages and they have a long way to go but there is still a lot of hunters out there that absolutely apose it. Its because these hunters have been going there for years unchecked and now they must have a license and be told where and when they can and its not sitting right them.
I do beleive the GC is a very good thing in opening more area for fella's like us!
jindydiver
05-06-06, 12:33 PM
Good on you Dama for getting behind the GC. Now that we have it we must support it or we will all be doing hunting in NSW a grave disservice.
Jindy your comment about subsidising the G licence with your R licence. Sorry I do not understand that comment. Could you please explain what you mean?
You said it yourself…
The funds raised, all money raised through selling licences will stay within the GC and does not end up in the general coffers. It is nothing to do with a tax on hunting rather the system has to become self sufficient.
Unfortunately you are wrong, in that the fees we pay are indeed a “tax” albeit a tax that only goes to where we expect it too rather than to consolidated revenue. After all the system "has to become self sufficient".
What do we get for buying a “G” licence?
We get the legal right to shoot the same deer we had the legal right to shoot for free before the advent of the GC. You might say that we get the public liability insurance, and that the insurance would be reason enough to buy the licence, but there are many of us who have the exact same insurance through our membership of the SSAA and we have to buy them both now to hunt deer. Do we get to claim twice if there is an incident and a claim needs to be made? No, of course not, so the insurance we buy as part of the “G” licence is just an added cost that many deer hunters have to put up with now.
So, seeing as the GC has a need to be self funding in order to give us something many people are glad for, that is access to state forests, the GC must charge people who receive nothing in return (“G” licence holders) a tax so that they can raise the funds to administer the “R” licence system.
Another point just to be sure we understand the history behind this.
It was never meant to be an open system where anyone can hunt.
The original idea was that we would indeed have free access to forests, just as they do in Victoria, but the political reality of one man (John Tingle, of the Shooters Party) trying to get something like that through was that he had to make it a lot more palatable to the masses in NSW and make it such that the process would stand up to the bad mouthing it was going to get from the “anti bloody everything that is fun” crowd.
He made some great decisions before tabling the act and you can imagine that given the greens and the ******s are making a huge noise now, any “open slather” hunting proposal would have got nowhere.
You also might not know that between the first reading of the act into parliament and the final passing of the bill there were over 100 amendments forced onto it by Clover Moore and the idiot brigade.
And this is just a bit disingenuous of you…
At the end of the day this time last year we had no legal hunting in forests in NSW, in a few weeks time for the cost of an R licence and some time spent meeting the criteria you will by mid july have access to about 1.4 million hectares of public land.
Prior to the repeal of section 32B of the forestry act on the 6 August 2004 hunting was indeed allowed in state forests the state over, upon issuance of a permit from the forestry commissioner. The problem with this old system was it was open to abuse and was seen as far from fair by those hunters who were unable to get a permit because the forest managers had given them all to mates or family (or whatever).
What the GC has done is remove the biases (both real and perceived) from the system and open the forests for anybody who wants to “jump through the hoops” and get a “R” licence. There are a lot of hunters that oppose the GC because they have had a really good deal until now, and you can understand that, but we all get to have a permit now (if we want them) and that has to be a good thing.
To make my position clear on the GC.
I support the GC and I realise that it is our best, last hope for getting hunting recognised as a legitimate pastime by the government and the people of NSW.
But I have (and will always) speak up if I see something that appears to be unfair or unwarranted being foisted upon the hunters of NSW. I do have semi-regular contact with staff members within the GC and they are more than happy to get feedback both good and bad on what they are doing. This is a new concept in the governance of hunting in Australia and they are bound to have teething troubles, and it is because the anti brigade are nipping at their heels all the time (and by default all hunters heals) that we have to give them our full support and make them aware of possible problems before they become intractable and lead to the end of our way of life (in respect of hunting :wink: ).
Sorry for the long essay :)
thanks for taking the time fellas
it will be interesting to see if other state's gov's follow the lead (and let's hope they do)...
Luke :D
aussiehunter
05-06-06, 01:05 PM
i dont like to single out one body of hunters,but what the hell is it with dog hunters,,
they are also a major problem up here ,they just think they can go anyway they wish..
we also have many southners who drive up here armed to the teeth,dogs on board and think this is open country to them all.
need stiffer penalties to anyone breaking the rules either in these forestries under the gc and everywhere else.
jmho
pat :)
Mick,
Sorry I was oversimplifying the forests. Yes prior to the GC sytem there was hunting in the forests but from what I have been told it was a difficult system to get a permit under and each forest was different. Many people I have spoken to thought it was virtually non working, but you are correct it did exist.
The G licence provides for people who only wish to hunt deer on private land and those wanting to be part of the Duck control programs on the rice. A lot of the G licences were sold to people only wanting to shoot ducks on the rice. (NPWS Game Bird Management Program)
From what I understand this has not translated to these people buying R licences. As here is still currently more G licences out there than R licences it might be argued that they are subsidising us for our licences.
It must be pointed out for people not familiar with the system if you hold an R licence you do not require a G licence as well. The R licence covers all hunting including that under the G licence.
I agree with the double dipping for the insurance, I currently pay this levy 3 times with my memberships and hunting licence.
I do not see the licence fee as a tax rather an investment in helping secure the future of hunting in NSW. The GC is very strong in defending hunters against attacks form the antis. They are our voice to government, that is why they have my support.
I was not aware of the concept that the forests were to be opened as free access like Victoria. I will need to check this out. In Vic you still require a hunting licence to hunt deer and in much of the high country where deer hunting is allowed shooting other animals including ferals is illegal. So in Vic you pay to hunt deer but the access is free. In NSW you pay for a single licence that allows you to hunt certain species and gain access to public land.
Daryl
jindydiver
05-06-06, 02:51 PM
From what I understand this has not translated to these people buying R licences. As here is still currently more G licences out there than R licences it might be argued that they are subsidising us for our licences.
It has nothing to do with how many of each licence has been purchased. EVERY hunter who wants to go on hunting deer in NSW (on private property) and who already has the insurance offered through some other organisation, is being made to buy something for which he has no use. The GC doesn’t do anything to help these people (but they do a lot for people who are buying the “R” licence) and so those “G” licence holders are obviously paying for work which is benefiting someone else.
It can be argued that the GC is supporting all hunters through it’s campaign to make all Australians aware of the good hunters can do, but any benefit this campaign might be having is impossible to quantify. So if we stick with work we can SEE to be happening it can easily be seen that “R” licence holders are getting most of the benefit, while “G” licence holders are paying most of the bills.
As I said originally, I object to having to buy a licence to subsidise others who are buying a different licence, but I pay the money and I just take it on faith that the GC will have benefits for me (and other hunters like me) in the end, even if it is no more than a flow on awareness of hunting in general among the wider public (which I see as a good thing).
ricochet
22-07-06, 08:34 AM
Hopefully will do a test next week for the R Licence, here in Shepparton. over the past few weeks have done a First aid course, and a chain saw course, now this R Licence, getting to old for all this :lol:
Rick
I've just recieved my R Licence in the mail last week, only took 4 days from sending away the paperwork to having it delivered. :)
Probably won't get away for a trial run for a couple of weeks, sure will be novel to be in a State Forest with a bow though!
jindydiver
25-07-06, 06:35 AM
Well, the issue is all rather moot for me now, I did my test, put in my application, and will be receiving my updated licence in the mail shortly. :)
I am really looking forward to visiting again forests I had (legal) access to all those years ago.
ricochet
25-07-06, 07:12 PM
Did my test, inc Rifles,shotguns, Blackpowder, Bows, and hunting dogs, sending it all away tomorrow, should get my R licence shortly :D
Rick
You may notice that there a couple of forests labelled "Bows Only" :wink:
Try and keep away from the forests that everybody know's about - a perfect example is Pennsylvania :)
I have got my Firearms R-License, I'll have to update to Bows soon too.
I believe many Queenslanders will be purchasing the G and R licenses.
I think (and please, these are my thoughts and that alone) that a positive out come in NSW may (and I stress may) open up opportunities in Qld.
The more bow-hunters that get behind the GC gives us a louder, more pursuasive voice.
Look at the bigger picture, not just NSW, think of the other states in Australia.
Qld has some wonderful state forrest and land that abounds in both nasty tusky critters and Deer. I think you may find that if the NSW GC is viable then Qld may wish to cash in on this and do the same.
For $1.15 per week I am in!
Jindy, great read, well debated, would love to catch up one day. Dama, thank you for all the work you have done with the GC.
Excellent thread fellas!
why would they give licences to doggers in State Forests. :evil: i know from some hunts ive been on that dogs dont just go for pig ive seen plenty of times a dog chase a wombat down a burrow only to have the owner go off its nut at the dog. some doggers go out there with new dogs that dont have mutch experiance and even loose dogs :roll: i think this idea is a joke our native wildlife is under threat as it is without some doggers running threw our State Forests.
just my thought :evil:
frisky
.........
Frisky, I disagree, while there are many doggers who do not train there dogs fully and there is always that risk that a dog may run off etc, many doggers out their that are very passionate about there sport. To have a well trained dog or dogs it takes these guys dedication everyday. You can't put a dog away for a year and then get it out of its case and go hunting.
It comes down to ethics; there are also many bowhunters and rifle shooters out there that are a disgrace to the rest of us as well.
It’s up to the rest of us to report hunters that act in a irresponsible way.
Don't get me wrong though, I wish all of the forests where bow only. :)
Just remember if it was just bowhunters we would be a small force, lets all stick together.
John
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