New Knife build-along (PIC HEAVY)

[Jimmy Alexander]

Ok trying another knife, a skinner this time as i lost mine recently. I dont need a boot dagger or a thrower.
Ill try do it build along style. I couldnt finish today as im quite sick :cry: but i had a crack. Had to get out and do something.
Some of the things i used
http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x105/JimLongBow/Tools.jpg

You always wanna protect eyes/ears.
http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x105/JimLongBow/Eyeearprotection.jpg

Ok i drew my knife with a stencil using the protractor to get the curves i wanted and as i like a heavy handle and light blade, i added some holes.
I carefully cut it out
http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x105/JimLongBow/Cutoutcarefully.jpg

Then i traced onto my saw blade
http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x105/JimLongBow/Traceontoblade.jpg

Clamped it to a saw stool
http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x105/JimLongBow/Calmpbiggestside.jpg

Cut away from myself.(Never take the gaurd off your grinder)
http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x105/JimLongBow/Grindaway.jpg

The rough out. I decided to leave a little extra on the handle so i could shape for my hand better.
http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x105/JimLongBow/Roughcut.jpg

Grinding the finished shape and finger grooves. Always keep a small bucket of water and dip frequently.NO DONT DIP FREQUENTLY ITS NOT A CHISEL!!!:oops: I dont wear gloves so i can feel how hot the steel gets.



http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x105/JimLongBow/Grindingshape.jpg

An edge and a quick clean up. Bloody bevel, need a lynisher :)

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x105/JimLongBow/Bloodybevel.jpg

Drill the holes out, i had to retire at this stage but if i can get out of bed tomorrow ill temper and get a handle on her.
http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x105/JimLongBow/Drillholes.jpg

[adam]

Nice knife mate, but your safety boots are shockers :shock:

Love the shape, ill try me one for sure.

Adam

[grooveyguru1]

I never would have thought of using an old saw blade like that, but will have to give it a go now. Can't wait for the rest of the story now

[Jimmy Alexander]

Turns out the bigger the blade the less impuritys (spelling) and that was only a 9 1/4. It is still temprerable (spelling), (even a word?) im experementing now with the offcuts and brittleness out the oven.
It can still be done with a little nouse (spelling)
The best saw blades to use would be Demo saw blades and big mill blades. The bigger the better. But i will persist and ill put some thongs on next time. :D
Where is the bloody spell check :lol:

[jindydiver]

Glad to help mate


First thing you want to do is put a guard on that grinder.
Put it on so the blade is proud out the top, and use the grinder
with the body in the air, so you are holding the grinder by both handles
and you feed it into the steel just like it is a saw.
This allows you to make long straight cuts and you get heaps more life
out of those thin cut off blades. With the guard on you can use it to
hold the machine off the work and then you just gently feed it along
the line you want to cut.


Don't keep quenching the blade as you grind it. Besides being a waste of
time the heat is useful in drawing the hardness out of the handle so you
can get it to drill. If you want it softer so it drills easier you need to
anneal it. You heat the blank in your forge (or BBQ, whatever the case may be)
and then when it is good and hot (just like hardening it) you stick it
into a tub of ashes (good fine ones) and leave it buried there till it cools.
If it takes all day that is good, the longer it takes the better the result.

When you go to do your heat treatment you need to "normalise" the steel
that is you need to remove the stresses introduced by the uneven heating
of the steel during your grinding. You heat you knife to non-magnetic in
your forge and then just pull it out and let it sit in the air till you can see
no more color in it. You can do this a few times to be sure it is done well,
but you need to be sure you don't get it too far over the non-magnetic
because some steel will get a lot of grain growth from continual heat cycles.
Simple steels like o1, W1 and L6 don't suffer this but you don't know what
is in that saw blade.
If you don't normalise you risk the blade cracking during the quench
or after the quench as you get it ready for the temper. It also reduces
the incidence of warping during heat treatment. Even with all this you
have to be prepared to loose a few blades just because you are using
recycled steel, my bucket full of broken blades and bits shows I know about this first hand :roll: :lol:

[Jimmy Alexander]

Wow, more to it than i thought :shock: . This is a good thing though knowlege is the best tool. I might not anneal it cos ill probably bugger it. Id rather buy more drill bits i think :D Bloody great infomation cheers.
If im up for it ill go down to kennards for some old blades tomorrow, if not the barbie will be burning all day.
Thanks again mate
Jimmy

P.S. Sorry Jindy Hate the guard it stays off :oops: Nothing against them though, just always adjusting them ****s me and i cant use them now. Mr Stubborn they call me :lol:

[jindydiver]

You can't wreck your knife annealing it if you make the effort to
normalise it before heat treating it. And you will save a fortune in drill bits.
I don't need to worry about adjusting the guard, the grinder
for cutting blanks only does that job.
It is up to you on the guard, but I find I can rest it on the work while
I run the grinder along the cut, it makes the work easier :wink:

[Jimmy Alexander]

Ok im gunna give it a go. The barbie will be burning all day tomorrow.
With the grinder im always using it for different things, tiles, eve sheets, timber. And i can use it upside down & backwards for the tight/tricky cuts in roofs etc. :shock:
I know i know, maybe ill go to bunnings and get a ****ter for my knives. It will save me money in the long run with discs, avoiding twists and uneven pressure. I was born with a nail gun and grinder in my hands :lol:

Cheers Jimmy :lol: :lol: :lol:

[chris]

Hi Jimmy

Don’t take this the wrong way, but don’t be a ****!!!!!! Put a ****ing guard on your grinder. I work with these all day and have done for 12years. I have lost count of how many fingers I have seen not on the hand. The grinder will not stop with one finger. If it ****’s you or you think it slows you down, just think about how ****y you will be when are in hospital missing fingers and cant finish such a nice knife, or shoot your bow.

By the way it is a VERY NICE knife.

Chris

PS if you do hurt your self on the grinder and it dose not have a guard on it, your health insurance may not pay for your treatment.

[Hoyt_Trykon]

Very interesting. Never thought about makign a knife like that. Thats a must try thing to do. Thanks for sharing it with us mate.

[wazza_X force]

doesnt look extremely difficult either... it'd just be a matter of trial and error i suppose...

thanks for sharing jimmy...

wazza

[Jimmy Alexander]

Hey Chris thanks for your opinion about the grinder, as i said i must get a ****ter for my knife making so i can keep the gaurd on. Keep the personal affronts to yourself next time though :lol:
The only way ill loose a finger or 2 with the grinder is if the blade grows 100mm and then bevels into them. Not sure about you but i clamp my steelwork to steel saw horses so i dont have to hold it with my free hand. Thats for the camera :lol:
Your concern is missplaced in this matter though my fellow twanger.
Thanks for all the imput guys this is gunna be one big thread when im finished.

Cheers Jimmy :)

[chris]

Jimmy

What do you think would happen if the cutting disc shattered when you are using it with out a guard?
I am not concerned about you holding the steel, you should use 2 hands if you are using a grinder. Have you ever had a disc grab when using a 5in grinder and it happens more when cutting thin stuff.

Sorry about the name calling but I have seen it way to many times to fluff around the topic.

Now go and put a guard on the thing :D

Chris

[jindydiver]

Ask me how many of those thin discs I have had self destruct (with some help from me :oops: ), no way I wouldn't have a guard on my grinder :wink:

[chris]

and a face shield with safety glasses.

you can say i seen a bit of personal damage done by grinders.

Chris

[Hoyt_Trykon]

Safety comes first. You dont want anything to jeoperdise (spelling) your bowhunting.[/i]

[wazza_X force]

i must admit HT, it doesnt look right, but i bet i couldnt have done better at spelling gepredise...lol... see, mines not much better... :oops:

wazza

[Jimmy Alexander]

Ha ha ha your so silly :lol: Ive had em shatter a few times on me and the worst that happend was a grazed knuckle off a bit that ricochet off the beam i was cutting. These little blade fragment into pieces that can do minimal harm. A 9" though, well they hurt. Smashed me in the leg and that was with the gaurd on. No claret though.
I dont have the gaurd for that grinder, as i said i must get a ****ter. And first lesson with a grinder, cut away from yourself in case she bites. I thought after 12 years experience you would know that :shock:

No offence at the name calling taken Chris. It was to be expected with people of uncommon good sense reading my threads :wink:

You sound just like my mother :D
Cheers Jimmy :lol: :lol:

[Hoyt_Trykon]

lmao,
funny one wazza.

[Jimmy Alexander]

Ok here we go again. Couldnt get much done today to crook but i did a little.

Fired up the forge
http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x105/JimLongBow/TheForge.jpg

Burnt some newspaper for some nice fine ashes. It was pising down so thats all i could burn.
http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x105/JimLongBow/Ashes.jpg

Heated the blade bringing some nice colours out.
http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x105/JimLongBow/Goingblue.jpg

Got it unmagnetised and put in bucket of ashes. I put some timber im the bottom of the bucket just in case.
http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x105/JimLongBow/Intothebucket.jpg

Repeated twice, been at it since 8am, the longer it takes, the better. and now its like drilling through butter, well not quite but much easier. Thanks Jindy.
http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x105/JimLongBow/Likebutter.jpg

Now back to bed cos its cold and wet. :wink:
http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x105/JimLongBow/Pissindown.jpg

Cheers guys Jimmy

[tempest404]

I love the look of it... can't wait to see final product

[jamie]

G'Day Jimmy,

Nice knife your making for your self there. Theres nothing like makeing and useing your own knife.

Mate if I can offer some advise please put a guard on that grinder. you may use it a 1000 times with no problems but it is the 1 time that it does shatter or you hold it the wrong way and it does bit you that you may regret. I'm a trady and I have done the same but as you get older you work out that you are not bullet proof. ( Step down off soap box.)

A couple of things on your knife. The handle looks to be a tad small and a funny shape that may not be to comfortable in the hand. Just my opinion.

H/T can be a fickle thing when useing second hand steel.On your next knife buy some 01 or 440 stainless steel and have it heat treated by a pro.

I live in Mc Crae 20min from you and have been making knives for about 4 years. If you want any help with finishing off that knife of yours feel free to send me pm.

[mayall]

Hi Jimmy
that is very good . mick has a lot of helpful information for . cant wait to see it finished

[Perry2007]

Great work so far! :D Better get it finished, i have alot of unfinished jobs lying around the place :lol:

[Jimmy Alexander]

Hi guys, thanks for helpfull comments.
Jamie some solid advice, cheers but its a skinner you cant have a big handle, just a heavy one :wink: . The shape has actually been made for my grip i think ive got a pic somewhere. Aha
http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x105/JimLongBow/Important.jpg
And your right there is nothing like making your own knife so theres no way im gunna send it off to get heat treated :? . With all the helpfull comments i cant mess up to bad and even if i do its all experience that will only help me. :D I really do appreciate your advice. I can still hear from the top of the box :lol: You dont want me stickin my mug in your shed, you'll never get rid of me :lol:


I seem to be repeating myself but i dont have a gaurd for that grinder.
As i said already(x3) i must buy a ****ter for my knife making.
And mayall, your website is on my favorites list, its like Tiger Woods telling my GREAT SHOT :D
Im beaming thanks again guys

Jimmy

[chris]

HI Jimmy

the knife is look good.
you can get a guard fron Bunnins or miter10 for $20.

have alook at the post i just put up and you will see why we are on your case :D

i am starting my second knife and will put some pics soon.

Chirs

[Marty]

Jimmy

Pleeease listen to Chris and Jindy re the gaurd on that grinder. And thongs as safety boots? What The?? :shock:

In my profession I have seen many people who thought injury wouldn't occur to them despite removing gaurds from power tools. And guess what. It does. Missing fingers are minor injuries compared to a couple of cases I have seen over the years. Ignoring basic safety procedures (such as goos boots) and the removal of gaurds on power tools will come back to bite you eventually. Maybe not this project or the next but you will get hurt eventually.

We are just concerned for your safety

Marty

[adam]

On the other hand, he could seriously injur himself and have no use for that great looking knife and one of us could buy it real cheap :twisted:

[jindydiver]

I grind in thongs, I hunt in thongs, in fact it has to be pretty hard country before I go to shoes. Doing the grinding in thongs isn't in the same league as not having a guard on the grinder. Biggest problem with wearing thongs is after you have cut out and profiled a half dozen knives you have feet so black you won't believe they are yours :lol:

Only time in the shop I don't were thongs is at the polisher. I am not sure that anything will stop a knife point spat out of that thing but who knows :)

[Jimmy Alexander]

O.K im back with a couple more pics of the normalisation process and the handle material
Been pretty cold so we had the gas heater going and i thought "ill chuck the blade in". 20min later...glowin.
http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x105/JimLongBow/Inthecoals.jpg

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x105/JimLongBow/Glowin.jpg

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x105/JimLongBow/Handle.jpg

I repeated the process 4 times and poppped it in the oven for 1/2 an hour
at 220deg. If your using old saw bades you have to find the right temp by cooking offcuts and twisting with pliers. You dont want it to snap straight away, you have to be able to twist a bit. I got a 90deg twist before it broke.

Stay tuned for the clean up and handle cut/fit.

Cheers Jimmy

[Jimmy Alexander]

Forgot the quench....Jindy help me. lol
Ill have to normalise it again i guess. If this thing doesnt crack ill be very suprised, and if it holds an edge. Ah well im only human, i guess thats a lesson better learnt now than with a nice piece of stainless or o1

Jimmy

[jindydiver]

Some simple steels are very forgiving and you can cycle them through
the critical heat many times and it wont hurt them. This is a good reason
to start with steels like O1 and L6 (and 5160 and a bunch of others :D )
and not with stainless steel that cost you real money.


Heat the knife to critical and then let it air cool. Then heat it again and go the quench,
clean it up and stick it in the oven and temper it and it will
still be as good as that blade can be (given that you don't know what the steel is in it).


Happens I was heat treating blades today....

Here they are in the oven
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v243/jindydiver/knife%20tutorial/tempering.jpg

And here is the color I have found works for this batch of steel
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v243/jindydiver/knife%20tutorial/tempered.jpg

[Jimmy Alexander]

Thanks mate maybe i should rename to jindy and jimmys build along lol
I think i will..... No i wont tarnish your name.
But a special mention to you for your help.

Cheers mate Jimmy